Re: Derailment in Springfield, OH Today.
Posted: Sat Mar 11, 2023 3:21 pm
Look at the bright side--- NS is becoming the leader at scrapping freight cars.
B1G - The Big Train
https://railroadfan.com/phpbb/
Someone’s gotta do it. For a while about 10 years ago it was CSX.joeyuboats wrote: ↑Sat Mar 11, 2023 3:21 pmLook at the bright side--- NS is becoming the leader at scrapping freight cars.
I needed to find a way to respond to all of these comments about this hot take that I made.MrAnderson wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 3:45 pmThis would just send all the traffic to trucks. And I know you know that's worse.David Collins wrote: ↑Sat Mar 04, 2023 8:03 pmIn my opinion, the FRA needs to shut NS' operations down until they can make new safety practices that the FRA can agree upon, and if the regulator doesn't like it, nothing moves on that railroad until the regulator is satisfied.
Here's why: NS at this point is a threat to public safety with all of these relatively large derailments becoming more and more frequent, and some of these are happening in some relatively large towns/cities. Of course, let's not forget the people getting sick who live in East Palestine and surrounding areas.
This whole bit of corporate incompetence has gone too far, and it's gotten to the point where it's not if, it's when people will start dying because of these derailments. and as of right now, with congrees being the way it is, the only people that can stop it are the folks at the FRA.
Rant over.
David Collins wrote: ↑Sat Mar 11, 2023 6:05 pmI needed to find a way to respond to all of these comments about this hot take that I made.MrAnderson wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 3:45 pmThis would just send all the traffic to trucks. And I know you know that's worse.David Collins wrote: ↑Sat Mar 04, 2023 8:03 pmIn my opinion, the FRA needs to shut NS' operations down until they can make new safety practices that the FRA can agree upon, and if the regulator doesn't like it, nothing moves on that railroad until the regulator is satisfied.
Here's why: NS at this point is a threat to public safety with all of these relatively large derailments becoming more and more frequent, and some of these are happening in some relatively large towns/cities. Of course, let's not forget the people getting sick who live in East Palestine and surrounding areas.
This whole bit of corporate incompetence has gone too far, and it's gotten to the point where it's not if, it's when people will start dying because of these derailments. and as of right now, with congrees being the way it is, the only people that can stop it are the folks at the FRA.
Rant over.
I don't care that (if this scenario were to happen) customers would have to move to trucks and deal the railroad a possibly lethal financial blow, these Wall Street Hedgefund guys have no f****** idea what they're doing, my response, short and sweet, Lives > Profit. It's an easy concept.
By the way, me being someone who cares about the environment and being told that "I should join the mainstream media" because I have said that the EPA should whoop NS' ass, not cool. We all have different opinions about the environment, but making fun of someone who cares about it in a case of a disaster like this should just not say anything.
Onwards.
AMEN !!Now it's time to respond to your response to your post to prove how out of touch with reality some of your ideas are.
Sure, it's going to take longer for companies to receive their goods, will likely need to keep more on hand for production, slow down mainlines and possibly shift hazardous cars into separate trains that roll at slower speeds. Put the tankcars on lower used routes to not interfere as much with faster moving freight. All sorts of issues involved in moving freight slower, but if we can move it slowly and dramatically decrease the risk of releases of these chemicals, maybe we can take the hit in cost associated with the slower move. There's a huge difference in long term effects between some loaded centerbeams carrying lumber catching on fire, and a tank car leaking thousands of gallons of chlorine or one with molten phosphorus.FRA's research demonstrates that the speed at which a train is traveling has the greatest effect on the closing velocity between cars involved in a derailment or other accident situation. Specifically, the research indicates that, in general, the secondary car-to-car impact speed is approximately one-half that of the initial train speed—the speed of the train at the time of the collision or derailment. Limiting the operating speed of tank cars transporting PIH materials is one method to impose a control on the forces experienced by these tank cars.
Well said PatAzo. What a great way of explaining the complex issue of a dichotomy with out personally attacking David Collins. I think we all know that shutting down NS is not really practical nor will it really increase safety. I think we also all agree that what happened is tragedy. No matter what happens afterwards different sides are going to have different ideas of how to handle the aftermath and how to proceed next.PatAzo wrote: ↑Sat Mar 11, 2023 10:52 pmDavid there is a dichotomy in your position. On one hand you don't care that hazardous materials would be diverted to trucks and on the other you care about the environment. Take a look at these transportation statistics on hazardous materials incidents and fatalities. https://www.bts.gov/content/hazardous-m ... amage-data Note that all of the fatalities in the past ten years have been highway related (zero rail). Trucks handle twice the hazardous shipment ton miles that rail does with a hazmat related incident rate 35 times greater than rail.
Wall Steet greed will bleed many a good thing into ruin. There is a case for better transportation safety. I would disagree that punishing NS's shareholders by shutting down the railroad is worth the decrease in transportation safety and the economic impact to the average person it would cause.
While you may be correct in your 60% number, virtually everyone in this country is in fact impacted by the performance of the stock market in some way, shape or form. Even the poorest of the poor are influenced by the stock market if they don't have the money for even basic needs. How many people in this country rely on social service programs either public or private. Many private organizations that provide social services in this country benefit heavily from trust fund proceeds which regularly come from the performance of the stock market.~Z~ wrote: ↑Sun Mar 12, 2023 10:09 amNo, actually no where near virtually everyone owns stock in one way or another. Last I read was approx 60% of people do. Of that, those who earn less, stocks dipping do far else to their wealth than those very well off. Whichever the case, as I said before, shutting down NS is lollerskates for an answer.
Does anyone know if there is actually a safe speed that hazardous tank cars can travel, so that when a derailment happens, that the tank car has virtually no chance of rupturing? GDLK strolls by at 10mph, and I just don't feel like it's going to leak should a derailment happen.
Found a document on the Federal Register stating:Sure, it's going to take longer for companies to receive their goods, will likely need to keep more on hand for production, slow down mainlines and possibly shift hazardous cars into separate trains that roll at slower speeds. Put the tankcars on lower used routes to not interfere as much with faster moving freight. All sorts of issues involved in moving freight slower, but if we can move it slowly and dramatically decrease the risk of releases of these chemicals, maybe we can take the hit in cost associated with the slower move. There's a huge difference in long term effects between some loaded centerbeams carrying lumber catching on fire, and a tank car leaking thousands of gallons of chlorine or one with molten phosphorus.FRA's research demonstrates that the speed at which a train is traveling has the greatest effect on the closing velocity between cars involved in a derailment or other accident situation. Specifically, the research indicates that, in general, the secondary car-to-car impact speed is approximately one-half that of the initial train speed—the speed of the train at the time of the collision or derailment. Limiting the operating speed of tank cars transporting PIH materials is one method to impose a control on the forces experienced by these tank cars.