Conrail Livernois Locals

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iandt
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Conrail Livernois Locals

Unread post by iandt »

In 1999, six locals worked out of Detroit's Livernois yard, which I have listed below. I have always been curious as to which areas these locals were assigned to work, if they ran transfer operations (to Wayne or River Rouge yards) or even interchanges (to Oakwood, for example). An old thread (http://www.railroadfan.com/phpbb/viewto ... 12&start=0) has already provided me with some answers, but I am looking for any possible help in figuring out where the other 3 locals worked. Here's the list:

YDLV-4 (days) works the Highland Park Industrial track, also called Terminal West. They only go as far as Clover Drive which is the location of the Frazer passing track.
YDLV - 6 works both the CSX & NS van sites as as well as the "junk yards". Metal Management now own the former Mars metal & Kewell yards. Levy's gets cars a couple of times a week.
YDLV-9 works the industries along John Kronk ave. known as the brick yard industrial, Ferrous ( scrap ) Cabot st.warehouse ( boxcars / loads in ) MNP ( wire ) and Hermies Automotive down by the old depot ( boxcars / loads out. Plus they do a little yard switching.
YDLV-15 ??
YDLV-33 ??
YDLV-34 ??

I ask because I have always wondered which local switched the sporadically serviced industries along the MC Line through Dearborn/Inkster (Greenfield Village, Standard Products Co., Hamler Industries, all active in the early 90s), and am hoping that one of the three listed above did. If anyone has information on this, if not associated with the locals I mentioned, this would be even more appreciated. Thanks in advance!

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M.D.Bentley
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Re: Conrail Livernois Locals

Unread post by M.D.Bentley »

Maybe this will help.........In 1999,
NY 3 not LV 4 did the Terminal West out of North yard.
LV 4 did yard switching and Mars & Keywells & Levis.
LV 6 did & still works the van sites (CSX & NS).
LV 9 works the Brick yard industries
LV 15 ( 2nd shift) back then did Detroit salt & Rouge Steel, But because there was NO operator on duty at Schaffer, they had to go the long way. Detroit line to River Rouge yard to Jct yard branch.This was also before Detroit salt had their own tracks and were loading cars on the branch. And when you had to switch Rouge Steel you would have shove the salt cars and the engine up the branch past the switch at gate 12 and switch Rouge Steel. Then you would have to pull the salt cars & engine back down to the Salt and then to the Rouge to runaround them and pull them back to Livernois yard.
LV 33 was the afternoon van site job, which on occasion would switch AJM Packing on Dix ave. if they had time.
LV 34 was the relief job. 2nd shift Thur & Fri RR 50 ( humper.) !st shift Sat,Sun & Mon LV 9, van site work
Any work west of Townline was done by one of the Wayne yard jobs, including transfers LV/WA.
Fred can fill in a little more when he can. Hello Fred ? Fred?

iandt
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Re: Conrail Livernois Locals

Unread post by iandt »

M.D.Bentley wrote:Maybe this will help.........In 1999,

LV 15 ( 2nd shift) back then did Detroit salt & Rouge Steel, But because there was NO operator on duty at Schaffer, they had to go the long way. Detroit line to River Rouge yard to Jct yard branch.This was also before Detroit salt had their own tracks and were loading cars on the branch. And when you had to switch Rouge Steel you would have shove the salt cars and the engine up the branch past the switch at gate 12 and switch Rouge Steel. Then you would have to pull the salt cars & engine back down to the Salt and then to the Rouge to runaround them and pull them back to Livernois yard.
LV 33 was the afternoon van site job, which on occasion would switch AJM Packing on Dix ave. if they had time.
LV 34 was the relief job. 2nd shift Thur & Fri RR 50 ( humper.) !st shift Sat,Sun & Mon LV 9, van site work
Any work west of Townline was done by one of the Wayne yard jobs, including transfers LV/WA.
Thank you!! That's exactly what I was looking for, though now I'm just as curious about how the transfer LV/WA ran. I didn't even think to look on Conrail's 1999 timetable to see if there was a transfer between the two yards.

Interesting how LV-15 was limited to working Detroit Salt from the Detroit Line, I'm sure there was no shortage of complaints about this arrangement at some point.

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M.D.Bentley
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Re: Conrail Livernois Locals

Unread post by M.D.Bentley »

iandt wrote:
M.D.Bentley wrote:Maybe this will help.........In 1999,

LV 15 ( 2nd shift) back then did Detroit salt & Rouge Steel, But because there was NO operator on duty at Schaffer, they had to go the long way. Detroit line to River Rouge yard to Jct yard branch.This was also before Detroit salt had their own tracks and were loading cars on the branch. And when you had to switch Rouge Steel you would have shove the salt cars and the engine up the branch past the switch at gate 12 and switch Rouge Steel. Then you would have to pull the salt cars & engine back down to the Salt and then to the Rouge to runaround them and pull them back to Livernois yard.
LV 33 was the afternoon van site job, which on occasion would switch AJM Packing on Dix ave. if they had time.
LV 34 was the relief job. 2nd shift Thur & Fri RR 50 ( humper.) !st shift Sat,Sun & Mon LV 9, van site work
Any work west of Townline was done by one of the Wayne yard jobs, including transfers LV/WA.
Thank you!! That's exactly what I was looking for, though now I'm just as curious about how the transfer LV/WA ran. I didn't even think to look on Conrail's 1999 timetable to see if there was a transfer between the two yards.

Interesting how LV-15 was limited to working Detroit Salt from the Detroit Line, I'm sure there was no shortage of complaints about this arrangement at some point.
Well Conrail wanted the crews to go across Schaffer diamond w/o an operator on duty, but the FRA stepped in and squashed that idea. It took awhile but operators were put back in the tower ( until they knocked it down ). The TT would not show any jobs. Transfers were on a as needed basis as most cars were set off their respective yards. Work trains, Hot cars, the Art Train were such moves.

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Re: Conrail Livernois Locals

Unread post by Fred »

Matt, I was working days at Livernois then & if I remember right (my memory sure ain't like it use to be !) LV-4 did Dearborn Steel & Kenwall Steel. LV-6 did both van sites as well as Levy, Keywell, & Mars scrap yards. I remember LV-51 (11pm job) did Dearborn Steel & Kenwall originally.

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Re: Conrail Livernois Locals

Unread post by iandt »

M.D.Bentley wrote: Well Conrail wanted the crews to go across Schaffer diamond w/o an operator on duty, but the FRA stepped in and squashed that idea. It took awhile but operators were put back in the tower ( until they knocked it down ). The TT would not show any jobs. Transfers were on a as needed basis as most cars were set off their respective yards. Work trains, Hot cars, the Art Train were such moves.
Thanks for this insight, I've always wondered which end the various industries west of Townline were worked from.

Thank you both! I didn't know that there were so many sporadic industries still working around Livernois at the time, I thought it had mostly been all trimmed down to the van sites and Ferrous scrap. Kind of surprising that Livernois was even around, really, considering River Rouge is just a short way away, across Delray. Just curious, as a follow-up to LV-9, do either of you know where most of the scrap from Ferrous was shipped? There's a picture from around 1977 which explains that, at that time, most of it went over the Detroit Line to Toledo, but I've always wondered if this changed somewhere between then and the NS takover.

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M.D.Bentley
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Re: Conrail Livernois Locals

Unread post by M.D.Bentley »

Fred wrote:Matt, I was working days at Livernois then & if I remember right (my memory sure ain't like it use to be !) LV-4 did Dearborn Steel & Kenwall Steel. LV-6 did both van sites as well as Levy, Keywell, & Mars scrap yards. I remember LV-51 (11pm job) did Dearborn Steel & Kenwall originally.
Sounds right Fred ( LV 4 ) thanks. They have tried the LV 4 job on all 3 shifts to try and get the work done without overtime. Back then they had to go through CSX's Rougemere yard, as well as drop off cars for the CSX and then on to Dearborn steel & Kenwall steel. Now they can use C.P. Lou and avoid Rougemere completely. When I hired out LIvernois was just about a ghost town . Most of the tracks were out of service and the yard was run by the River Rouge yardmaster, 2nd & 3rd trick IIRC.

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Re: Conrail Livernois Locals

Unread post by Fred »

When I took over the day job at Livernois in June, 1988 there was about 9 cars in the whole yard. Like Matt said, the company had tried to close down Junction Yard. A crew from River Rouge would bring cars over for the local industries & then return back to Rouge after completing their work. I was asked how to reduce the O.T. for that job & told them to start the job right at Livernois & eliminate all the travel time. By the next year there was about 5 jobs coming on duty at Livernois.
In fact, as far as 6 Penn Center was concerned, Livernois & Jct Yard was closed. By 1990 though, HQ had to recognize Livernois being open because it had more cars dispatched & received than North Yard
Back then the Cadillac Plant at Clark was still open & making some kind of part for the GM plant in Arlington, Texas that had to make the outbound train the same day the car was pulled from Cadillac. Ford Dearborn also was getting anywhere between 15 to 40 cars a day as well. Things were hopping at Livernois.
Scrap loads from Ferrous were going to places in Ohio & PA but I can't remember exactly where.

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