Conrail North Lansing/CSX Train Symbols from the early 90s

[GrandTrunkFan]

I'm looking for any pics of Conrail North Lansing from the early 90s era, specifically showing the signal arrangement or the industrial track to Demmer (Former main to Owosso). Ive watched Dan Cluley's great videos from Lansing and have a general idea of how it looked but its hard pulling details from a quick video clip


Also what were CSX symbols in the early 90s that would pass through Lansing? I know R200 and 201 were CP trains, and there was R326/27 and I'm guessing R334/35. Plus the locals, D708/9. Any others I'm forgetting?

[Saturnalia]

Official CSX Map by B P Beavers, 1995

[Tim]

According to Dave Hilton one of the northbound dwarf signals at North Lansing is now in service at Greenfield Village just west of the depot.

[Dan Cluley]

Glad you like the videos.

My notes from that time period are not super detailed, because I was usually too busy with the video gear to write much down until later.

What I remember is this:

200/201 The original CP trains that started running in the '80s. A little later, '92-'94?, they started regularly running more CP trains and added symbols for them. In the mid-late '90s 4-6 CP trains a day was pretty common. At some point these switched from 200 series to 500 series trains (possibly when they started running more?)

334/335 This pair ran between Toledo & Grand Rapids.

326/327 I think this pair ran between GR & Detroit.

336/337 I think this pair ran between GR & Flint or Saginaw.

It seems like I remember a 325 at one point, but that may have been earlier in the '80s


D709 was the local that ran east from Lansing.

D708 was the local that ran west from Lansing.

There were one or two yard jobs at Ensel. Probably Y101 & Y102? These would sometimes come out and swtich the GT interchange at Trowbridge & work the MSU power plant.

Consumers Power coal trains ran most days, but I don't remember the symbols.

There was a westbound that ran on Thursday night. Not sure of the symbol, but we called it the Lime train. It often had Conrail power, and consisted of covered hoppers (many lettered for Martin Marietta) I believe it came off the Conrail at Toledo and ended up in Ludington.

Grain trains & empties ran as needed. Not sure of those symbols either.

[GrandTrunkFan]

Glad you like the videos.

I sure do! They've been an incredible help deciding on motive power and freight cars. I hate you just had to post the video of Conrail YDLA backing down in front of the old wig wag on Isabel. I now want to try to squeeze that little branch into my layout!

My notes from that time period are not super detailed, because I was usually too busy with the video gear to write much down until later.

What I remember is this:

200/201 The original CP trains that started running in the '80s. A little later, '92-'94?, they started regularly running more CP trains and added symbols for them. In the mid-late '90s 4-6 CP trains a day was pretty common. At some point these switched from 200 series to 500 series trains (possibly when they started running more?)

334/335 This pair ran between Toledo & Grand Rapids.

326/327 I think this pair ran between GR & Detroit.

336/337 I think this pair ran between GR & Flint or Saginaw.

It seems like I remember a 325 at one point, but that may have been earlier in the '80s


D709 was the local that ran east from Lansing.

D708 was the local that ran west from Lansing.

There were one or two yard jobs at Ensel. Probably Y101 & Y102? These would sometimes come out and swtich the GT interchange at Trowbridge & work the MSU power plant.

Consumers Power coal trains ran most days, but I don't remember the symbols.

There was a westbound that ran on Thursday night. Not sure of the symbol, but we called it the Lime train. It often had Conrail power, and consisted of covered hoppers (many lettered for Martin Marietta) I believe it came off the Conrail at Toledo and ended up in Ludington.

Grain trains & empties ran as needed. Not sure of those symbols either.

336/337 is a new one to me. What did those trains normally carry? Were the coal trains at this time for West Olive? I never kept up on the coal train movements

[Dan Cluley]

I don't remember much about 336/337. My gut feeling is they ran late night/early morning so I didn't see them as much.

Pretty sure the Consumer Power trains were eastern coal going to West Olive. Lots of CPOX cars.

[Doktor No]

336/337 were GR to Flint trains but they originated/terminated at Barr Yard in Chicago. Crewed them to both destinations man many times. The Flint side were scheduled regular trains that were called at GR at 15:30 or so, picked up empty auto parts cars for Grand Blanc at Lansing off the CR side. Set out at Wixom and was supposed to set out the auto parts empties at Grand Blanc but they always said, take em to McGrew...mostly cause we were short on time by then.
Coming home from Flint, called at 00:30 we had cars off the D&M and the usual thumb and saginaw cars going westward towards Chitown, picked up auto parts for Olds/Lansing at Grand Blanc, made a usually large auto rack pickup at Wixom, set off the autoparts loads at the CR side of Ensle Yard in Lansing (called Just In Time and it worked like clockwork every day of the week.) and went thru to Wyoming yard where the train got switched out during the day and then proceeded westward to Chitown, usually totally reconfigured.
From time to time we also picked up cement empties at Lansing for LaFarge at Alpena from Boichot Cement and also set them off coming to GR at Lansing.
For awhile the 337 was almost all autos from Buick and Wixom with a couple of Lincoln Ford parts cars from Wixom to boot. It went right thru Wyoming, called outbound upon arrival for Barr.
There was a Q324 and some days a return Q325 to and from Toledo in the early 2000's, about the time I went into the yard at Wyoming. All switchers from Chicago to get blocked for Stanley, Willard, Cinnci and points south and east.
Thing about the train to Flint from GR, it was a regular assigned job. You got called at Wyoming 15:30. Got to Flint around 1AM. We then hung out at the motel out by the airport, Days Inn IIRC till 00:30. Trip home was one long drawn out affair and a butt dragger by the time the sun came up. Meets at almost every siding. But then you had a whole day off till the next afternoon at 15:30 and you could set your watch to the times for the most part. Towards the end I would arrive at McGrew, look over the yard printouts of Saginaw and McGrew and would see that there were almost nothing coming back and call the chief. DeadHead home then guys....then you got 2 days off at home, got paidd for the trip home so you dind't lose any money and all was well.

[Doktor No]

I always enjoyed looking over the train printouts for the loads and the destinations all over the US. From Flint the D&M gave us cars of paper from Fletcher in Alpena, hardbioard from Abitbi in Alpena, diapers from Cheboygan, cement from LaFarge for Lansing and elswhere. Other cars from the thumb area elevators, bagged turtle and pinto beans in boxcars for Mexico and assorted stuff from Saginaw/Bay City/Midland. Always had cars from Alma Total refinery. AvGasoline for an airport in Utah and asphalt for different places.
Picked up finished Lincolns and T-Birds at Wixom. Usually two long tracks out of that yard.
Going east on 336 we had tanks of vegetable oil for Abitibi in Alpena. They used it as a lubricant for the machinery pressing the woodchips into board. Empties for everyone and always major empty auto racks for Wixom that we set out evenings in the yard. We would fill two tracks at Wixom most days. Also had IHB gons from East Chicago loaded with bar stock for Saginaw Steering Gear.
Now Saginaw Steering gear is gone, Buick City is gone, Ford Wixom is gone, Abitibi and Fletcher in Alpena is gone. Total Leonard is gone... Saginaw Yard and McGrew is a shadow of its former self. Not a heck of a lot left is there....?

[Doktor No]

Coal loads and Coal empties went to Consumers Power West Olive James Campbell plant from various mines in KY. and W.V. The Conrail powered coal trains came from a mine in New Lexington, Ohio, east of Columbus. It was high sulphur but also high heat content. After the contract was done the mine closed, Consumers was their only customer.
Taking an empty Conrail powered coal train to Toledo we had a pair of A10's from Battle Creek ANG stage mock strafing runs at us around Sunfield-Woodbury to almost Grand Ledge. That was cool!
Lots of memories, twas a fun job most days but others were a real PIA to say the least. Many trips called on your rest from both ends of the line so little sleep. Weather wasn't always fun, bad power made for long slow trips and heavy trains did too. Toss in an ornery engineer...few and far between though....and thats why I went into the yard....regular hours and I took apart and built trains for the destinations I used to go to and never regretted leaving the road behind.
Nuff for now. Nostalgia Lane is closed for repairs.
Dano In Rockford

[Saturnalia]

*pressing the like button*

[AARR]

Same here, Dok. I like your reports about logistics

*pressing the like button*

[J T]

Official CSX Map by B P Beavers, 1995

Fixed.

[Saturnalia]

How are you supposed to read that? It's tilted to fit Penn Ave to Turner St...with the two 90 degree turns its a challenge to fit it all in

[Doktor No]

How are you supposed to read that? It's tilted to fit Penn Ave to Turner St...with the two 90 degree turns its a challenge to fit it all in

Stand on your head.

[J T]

How are you supposed to read that? It's tilted to fit Penn Ave to Turner St...with the two 90 degree turns its a challenge to fit it all in

Not my fault whoever made that map couldn't figure out how to draw it in a conventional format.

[GrandTrunkFan]

336/337 were GR to Flint trains but they originated/terminated at Barr Yard in Chicago. Crewed them to both destinations man many times. The Flint side were scheduled regular trains that were called at GR at 15:30 or so, picked up empty auto parts cars for Grand Blanc at Lansing off the CR side. Set out at Wixom and was supposed to set out the auto parts empties at Grand Blanc but they always said, take em to McGrew...mostly cause we were short on time by then.
Coming home from Flint, called at 00:30 we had cars off the D&M and the usual thumb and saginaw cars going westward towards Chitown, picked up auto parts for Olds/Lansing at Grand Blanc, made a usually large auto rack pickup at Wixom, set off the autoparts loads at the CR side of Ensle Yard in Lansing (called Just In Time and it worked like clockwork every day of the week.) and went thru to Wyoming yard where the train got switched out during the day and then proceeded westward to Chitown, usually totally reconfigured.
From time to time we also picked up cement empties at Lansing for LaFarge at Alpena from Boichot Cement and also set them off coming to GR at Lansing.
For awhile the 337 was almost all autos from Buick and Wixom with a couple of Lincoln Ford parts cars from Wixom to boot. It went right thru Wyoming, called outbound upon arrival for Barr.
There was a Q324 and some days a return Q325 to and from Toledo in the early 2000's, about the time I went into the yard at Wyoming. All switchers from Chicago to get blocked for Stanley, Willard, Cinnci and points south and east.
Thing about the train to Flint from GR, it was a regular assigned job. You got called at Wyoming 15:30. Got to Flint around 1AM. We then hung out at the motel out by the airport, Days Inn IIRC till 00:30. Trip home was one long drawn out affair and a butt dragger by the time the sun came up. Meets at almost every siding. But then you had a whole day off till the next afternoon at 15:30 and you could set your watch to the times for the most part. Towards the end I would arrive at McGrew, look over the yard printouts of Saginaw and McGrew and would see that there were almost nothing coming back and call the chief. DeadHead home then guys....then you got 2 days off at home, got paidd for the trip home so you dind't lose any money and all was well.

I always enjoyed looking over the train printouts for the loads and the destinations all over the US. From Flint the D&M gave us cars of paper from Fletcher in Alpena, hardbioard from Abitbi in Alpena, diapers from Cheboygan, cement from LaFarge for Lansing and elswhere. Other cars from the thumb area elevators, bagged turtle and pinto beans in boxcars for Mexico and assorted stuff from Saginaw/Bay City/Midland. Always had cars from Alma Total refinery. AvGasoline for an airport in Utah and asphalt for different places.
Picked up finished Lincolns and T-Birds at Wixom. Usually two long tracks out of that yard.
Going east on 336 we had tanks of vegetable oil for Abitibi in Alpena. They used it as a lubricant for the machinery pressing the woodchips into board. Empties for everyone and always major empty auto racks for Wixom that we set out evenings in the yard. We would fill two tracks at Wixom most days. Also had IHB gons from East Chicago loaded with bar stock for Saginaw Steering Gear.
Now Saginaw Steering gear is gone, Buick City is gone, Ford Wixom is gone, Abitibi and Fletcher in Alpena is gone. Total Leonard is gone... Saginaw Yard and McGrew is a shadow of its former self. Not a heck of a lot left is there....?

Coal loads and Coal empties went to Consumers Power West Olive James Campbell plant from various mines in KY. and W.V. The Conrail powered coal trains came from a mine in New Lexington, Ohio, east of Columbus. It was high sulphur but also high heat content. After the contract was done the mine closed, Consumers was their only customer.
Taking an empty Conrail powered coal train to Toledo we had a pair of A10's from Battle Creek ANG stage mock strafing runs at us around Sunfield-Woodbury to almost Grand Ledge. That was cool!
Lots of memories, twas a fun job most days but others were a real PIA to say the least. Many trips called on your rest from both ends of the line so little sleep. Weather wasn't always fun, bad power made for long slow trips and heavy trains did too. Toss in an ornery engineer...few and far between though....and thats why I went into the yard....regular hours and I took apart and built trains for the destinations I used to go to and never regretted leaving the road behind.
Nuff for now. Nostalgia Lane is closed for repairs.
Dano In Rockford

Wow 336/337 was once one hell of a busy train! But awesome info Dok! Thanks for sharing. Do you remember the symbols for the coal trains back then?