Harassment for photography: not just for us railfans anymore

Posts that don't fit in the other train categories. Off Subject Chit Chat I tell you. :)
User avatar
Railzfan
SpecialDuty
Posts: 466
Joined: Sun Oct 09, 2005 12:35 am
Location: Rockford, MI.
Contact:

Harassment for photography: not just for us railfans anymore

Unread post by Railzfan »

Found this interesting story online:

TORRANCE, Calif. – A Redondo Beach, Calif., man has filed a federal civil rights lawsuit against the Torrance police, contending officers detained and fingerprinted him, took his picture and asked if he was a terrorist after he took photos of the ExxonMobil refinery there, according to a Copley News Service story in the Daily Breeze newspaper. Torrance is 20 miles south of downtown Los Angeles.

In a lawsuit filed Dec. 14, Jim McKinniss says that at 4:25 a.m. on April 17 he was taking photographs from the sidewalk on Prairie Avenue of the refinery's fiery smokestacks as part of an assignment for a course he was taking at Otis College of Art.

The suit states McKinniss saw a security guard from the plant arrive in a vehicle, and seven minutes later two Torrance police cars arrived with their lights flashing. Four officers, not named in the lawsuit, approached him.

He reportedly told officers he was on public property and he did not think it was illegal to take photographs.

"One of the officers asked if McKinniss had heard about September 11th," the lawsuit states. The officer told McKinniss that since the 2001 terrorist attacks, it was illegal to photograph bridges, airports, and refineries, although no such law exists.

"One of the officers acknowledged that it was probably permissible to take photographs of a major tourist attraction, such as the Golden Gate Bridge, since so many people did so, but he did not otherwise retract or refine his statement that McKinniss was in violation of the law by photographing the ExxonMobil refinery," the lawsuit states.
Officers then ordered him to stand motionless with his hands clasped behind him. One officer patted him down.

"While she did so, one of the officers asked McKinniss if he was a terrorist. McKinniss replied that he was not," the lawsuit states.

Later, one officer took two or three pictures of him with a digital camera. Another officer took a print of his right thumb without his consent, the lawsuit states.

The suit said the encounter ended without officers telling him that the detention and investigation were over. But when the officers returned to their squad cars, one officer said over the speaker in his car, "Thanks, Jim."

"It's pretty apparent the Torrance Police Department unlawfully detained, searched, fingerprinted, and photographed a person who had every right to do what he was doing," McKinniss' lawyer, Robert Myers, said Thursday.

Myers said there have been similar complaints against police made by photographers across the country.

The lawyer said the main reason McKinniss filed the lawsuit is "to prevent this from happening to him again in Torrance. His major objective is not to make money off this lawsuit, but to make sure that he can go about taking photographs without being stopped by the Torrance Police Department."

The newspaper said the lawsuit also asks for punitive damages against the department, an order that the fingerprint and photographs of McKinniss be destroyed, and that department officials turn over a list of any law enforcement agencies that received information about his detention.

Lt. Rod Irvine, a spokesman for the Torrance Police Department, said he had not received a copy of the lawsuit, so he could not comment on it. But he did say that activity in the area near the refinery is "obviously a concern for us."

"It is a volatile location," Irvine added. "I think the federal government identified oil refineries as potential (terrorism) targets. It is one of our focuses of concern."

*************************************

I think that this photography ban thing has gone way to far, next it will be illegal to take pictures of our families :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
~Andrew Kersting

Website - Rocky Mountain Custom Models

Long Live the Denver & Rio Grande Western!

User avatar
patrick
Railroadfan...fan
Posts: 1589
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 7:46 pm

Unread post by patrick »

I see this type of thing daily as i live in a town with a major electric generating facility. Consumers makes no bones about letting people know they are being watched. They are nice about it but the gaurds keep an eye on you every move you make. I guess I can understand the company being on edge as it is an gas refinery, but you can only take it just so far when the person is on public property. I hear alot of people say "Cn police (as an example) will confiscate your cam and scanner if they catch you takeing picture" Fine and dandy, but as long as I'm on public property, or on property other than railroad property, I dare them to take my equipment. I too would sue the piss out of the company for something like that. We have a legal right with the freedom of press to photograph anything we want as long as we are not infringeing on the rights of others IE: taking pics of railroad switchmen on the ground. They may not always want to be in our pics, nor on the internet. I applaud this guy for having the balls to take the police department to court. Everyone says "remember 9-11" Well me, I'm trying to forget and get on with my life. I won't nor can I live my life in fear of another such attack. Noone else should either.

User avatar
Railzfan
SpecialDuty
Posts: 466
Joined: Sun Oct 09, 2005 12:35 am
Location: Rockford, MI.
Contact:

Agree with you....

Unread post by Railzfan »

Couldn’t agree with you more patrick, I have heard a lot of bad things about CN chasing away railfans.

I am anti CN
:evil: :evil: :evil:
~Andrew Kersting

Website - Rocky Mountain Custom Models

Long Live the Denver & Rio Grande Western!

User avatar
patrick
Railroadfan...fan
Posts: 1589
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 7:46 pm

Unread post by patrick »

I too am anti CN. If it wasn't for the fact they employ a ton of people in this state.... I'd say take you butts back to canada where ya belong.

Aleks
Railroadfan...fan
Posts: 406
Joined: Thu Aug 25, 2005 10:11 pm
Location: Brantford, Ontario

Unread post by Aleks »

It must be unique to your area cause I've never been hasseled by CN police here. A cruiser shows up at Brantford now and again and he's never approached me or any other railfans here that I'm aware of.

User avatar
Eric Berger
Railroadfan...fan
Posts: 255
Joined: Sat Oct 23, 2004 11:17 am
Location: Southeast Michigan

Unread post by Eric Berger »

I agree, Patrick -- especially since President Bush himself said right after 9/11 that we "Need to return to our normal lives."
"From a really tall tower, in the middle of a really big field..."

User avatar
Railzfan
SpecialDuty
Posts: 466
Joined: Sun Oct 09, 2005 12:35 am
Location: Rockford, MI.
Contact:

Unread post by Railzfan »

Pres. Bush did say that we need to return to our “normal” lives, the government is the only thing that’s keeping us from doing so!
~Andrew Kersting

Website - Rocky Mountain Custom Models

Long Live the Denver & Rio Grande Western!

Post Reply