QLine crash with auto

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NYCMan
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QLine crash with auto

Unread post by NYCMan »

Well, I am surprised that QLine went this long without a rail-auto crash. Maybe there have been others that just did not make the news?

http://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/l ... 107407094/

hoborich
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Re: QLine crash with auto

Unread post by hoborich »

The comments are better than the article. Seems the only people in favor of the Qline were railfans and Detroit officials.


Dave Somerville ·
Works at SELF-EMPLOYED HUMAN RESOURCES LABOR MANAGEMENT/RETIRED
The BOONDOGGLE, good grief!
Like · Reply · 5 hrs

Garnis Siebert ·
National university
It's as useful as the people mover. Not well thought out by the engineers.
Like · Reply · 1 · 8 hrs

Allen Majorovic ·
Detroit, Michigan
Here, in a single incident, is much of what's wrong with the idea.

The QLine is fragile. Anything that stops a single Q-Line car stops the entire system.

But along with the fragility you get inflexibility and high costs.

The system also doesn't make a lick of sense.

What was the backup to this blockage of the QLine? Buses.

Buses that could just as easily, and on any given day, replace the QLine with no one much noticing. About all that would be left to remind people of the QLine's existence would be the track grooves and they'd fill up in a couple of weeks.
Like · Reply · 3 · 9 hrs

Maggie Peel ·
Detroit, Michigan
Is this the 7th accident with the QLine? Wow! It's not even winter yet.
Like · Reply · 9 hrs

Jeff Bickerstaff ·
Grosse Pointe Shores, Michigan
The Q Line offerend to refund the full fare to all passengers aboard the car - until it was found that none of them actually purchased a ticket.
Like · Reply · 5 · 9 hrs

Dave Somerville ·
Works at SELF-EMPLOYED HUMAN RESOURCES LABOR MANAGEMENT/RETIRED
Fraud has a history in the D.
"Ask your doctor if medical advice from a TV commercial is right for you".

MiddleMI
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Re: QLine crash with auto

Unread post by MiddleMI »

You mean to tell me that crusty, get-off-my-lawn curmudgeons park out in the comments sections of newspapers all day long and decry everything?! Why I never! Procure me my smelling salts, post haste!

The QLine had its first accident with an automobile - one by the way in which it was clearly not at fault. BFD. A car stupidly swerved in front of a bus, which sent the car flying across traffic to the other side of the street.

Hell, METRORail down in Houston had six crashes per month in its first year.

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Doktor No
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Re: QLine crash with auto

Unread post by Doktor No »

Post haste INDEED!
Curb Your Enthusiasm.

PatAzo
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Re: QLine crash with auto

Unread post by PatAzo »

I always thought the comments were for entertainment value only.

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AARR
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Re: QLine crash with auto

Unread post by AARR »

Often the comments are more entertaining than the article :lol: .
PatAzo wrote:I always thought the comments were for entertainment value only.
PatC created a monster, 'cause nobody wants to see Don Simon no more they want AARR I'm chopped liver, well if you want AARR this is what I'll give ya, bad humor mixed with irrelevant info that'll make you roll your eyes quicker than a ~Z~ banhammer...

hoborich
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Re: QLine crash with auto

Unread post by hoborich »

That's what I said. Sniff :D

The comment was spot on. An accident with one car brings the whole system to a halt. The Qline is a novelty, intended to draw in tourists. How is it any better than a bus? As for the accident, it doesn't matter who is at fault if it brings the system to a halt. And the Qline is vulnerable to accidents in which it isn't even involved, if it can't get around them, like a bus could.
"Ask your doctor if medical advice from a TV commercial is right for you".

MiddleMI
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Re: QLine crash with auto

Unread post by MiddleMI »

Then you're against any street rail. And that's fine; you don't have to ride it and I'm sure the regular riders have a mutual feeling on that. No one is going to sit here and debate the merits of streetcars with someone being disingenuous, though. You've made up your mind; good for you.

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SousaKerry
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Re: QLine crash with auto

Unread post by SousaKerry »

The Qline is a novelty, intended to draw in tourists.
If that were completely true then wouldn't they have picked a more attractive and fun retro street car design instead of the slug on rails?
What smells like lube oil and diesel.... Oh wait it's just my "Locomotive Breath"

hoborich
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Re: QLine crash with auto

Unread post by hoborich »

Ridership down 40% since the free period ended. And only half of those are paying. Turns out the taxpayers weren't told the fares would be on the honor system when the idea was pitched. Again, the comments tell more than the article. And no one is talking about all the businesses that went out of business while the line was being built.And there is concern that stepped up enforcement of fares will further decrease ridership.

http://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/l ... 105860766/

http://www.crainsdetroit.com/article/20 ... ship-falls
"Ask your doctor if medical advice from a TV commercial is right for you".

MiddleMI
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Re: QLine crash with auto

Unread post by MiddleMI »

“We’re in the area of about 40 percent, but we don’t know exactly right now,” Lijana said. “However, according to the Federal Transportation Administration, the average collection rate for streetcars is only 35 percent nationally, so we’re actually above average.”
And that was probably two months ago, now. Money wasn't the only reason for the drop (almost all have drops after they do the free period), and they reworked how they were running the cars. The QLine is quite successful.

Anyway, stay off and out of the way of the QLine, hobo. It wasn't meant for you...and that's okay.

OwlCaboose2853
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Re: QLine crash with auto

Unread post by OwlCaboose2853 »

Monorail is best than light rail! See link in Monorail vs other rails http://www.monorails.org/tMspages/MonoVs.html
Amtrak Wolverines
NS Michigan Lines
Ann Arbor RR
The Monorail Society

Steven R. Williams

hoborich
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Re: QLine crash with auto

Unread post by hoborich »

The QLine is quite successful.
So....40% of the passengers are paying their fares instead of the 35% national average, and you call that successful? I call it bait and switch. No one told the taxpayers that nationally only 35% of streetcar riders ever pay their fares when the idea was pitched to the taxpayers. On Floridas Tri Rail, armed security guards come through the train from time to time, randomly checking passengers tickets. If you don't pay, you get arrested. In Detroit, if you don't pay, you get a lecture from an "Ambassador". Sounds like a great plan to increase compliance. :lol:

Here's more from Crains Business. Their budgeting is based on 5000 passengers. And while they don't specifically say so, I assume they meant 5000 "Paying" passengers per day.

M-1 Rail CEO Matt Cullen has said in the past that the system will continue to seek money from corporate donors and government aid, work to sell more advertising, or it could resell the naming rights. Dan Gilbert, who is co-chairman of M-1 Rail and Cullen's boss, had his Quicken Loans Inc. buy the line's naming rights for $5 million over 10 years.

The system also relies on passenger fares, which are scheduled to begin, after several delays, on Sept. 5. The QLine was averaging about 4,800 riders a day through mid-July, and expects that to drop temporarily once paid service begins. It expects to hit its 5,000-per-day budgetary goal within 12 months, and reach 8,000 daily within five years.

The streetcar system also has been in talks for a year with an undisclosed donor for a $5 million pledge.

"M-1 Rail always expected to do additional fundraising for operational funding. Conversations are underway and encouraging but final paperwork has not yet been signed," Lijana said. "Conversations have been ongoing with potential funders throughout construction of the QLine, while we prepared for passenger service and as we begin revenue operations. Those discussions continue in a positive direction and the early success of the QLine indicates we will raise the necessary funds."

Another source of money to run the trains could come in the form of a dedicated transit tax. Voters in November rejected just such a tax when the Regional Transit Authority of Southeast Michigan put an issue on the ballot in Wayne, Oakland, Macomb and Washtenaw counties that would have raised $3 billion over 20 years to pay for improved mass transit, including the QLine's operations.
"Ask your doctor if medical advice from a TV commercial is right for you".

Raildudes dad
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Re: QLine crash with auto

Unread post by Raildudes dad »

I'm pretty sure the 35-40% fare number is the percentage of a systems operating cost recovered at the "fare box" what ever it is, not 2/3 of the passenger's beat the system nationwide.

hoborich
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Re: QLine crash with auto

Unread post by hoborich »

The article from Crains Business clearly states only 40% of the passengers are paying THEIR FARES!!!!!

From Crains Detroit Business!
Payment service went into effect Sept. 5
60 percent of QLine riders are not paying
Daily ridership falls from 5,000 to 3,000


Four in 10 QLine passengers paid to ride the streetcar up and down Woodward Avenue after Detroit's newest vehicle for mass transit ended a summer of free rides after Labor Day.

Average daily ridership on the QLine fell to 3,000 from the 5,000 people who were using it on a daily basis over the summer when private donors were paying for rides while the streetcar service worked out kinks in the payment system.

The percentage of riders actually paying was 40 percent, which QLine spokesman Dan Lijana said is higher than 32.5 percent national average of similar downtown city rail systems.

At a 40 percent pay rate, that means an average of 1,200 riders are paying fares on a daily basis through either daily, monthly or annual passes.

The QLine's operators have a goal of an average daily ridership of 5,000 from this month through next September

"We are very confident QLine will reach that goal," Lijana said in an email to Crain's. "Early numbers suggest we are picking up more commuters in the early evening and attracting significant numbers of special event riders."

Since the payment service went into effect Sept. 5, QLine ambassadors have been directing riders to the payment kiosks at each stop along Woodward, LiJana said.

M-1 Rail, the nonprofit organization that runs the QLine, plans to step up payment enforcement measures, Lijana said.

"We are likely to increase enforcement of all ordinances including fare using transit police in the near future," he said. "We've used the ambassador program as a way to help educate riders on payment."
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My only concern here is that the taxpayers were told that 5000 people would ride the Qline per day, and it was assumed that they would all be paying passengers. If the legislature and the taxpayers had been told ridership would only be around 3000 per day and only 40% of them would pay their fares, there is no way this project would ever have been approved. Being a railfan does not obligate me to support every multi million dollar boondoggle that comes down the pike. And the 60% not paying their fares was totally predictable, given the location of this pie in the sky project.

http://www.crainsdetroit.com/article/20 ... ship-falls
"Ask your doctor if medical advice from a TV commercial is right for you".

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