Superliners Vs. Horizon

[amtrak1007]

most likely a man-power shortage if there was only one conductor....

Most likely... with that pool.

[Standard Railfan]

Except the passengers have either just got on or are preparing to get off and the conductor is on the end of the train protecting a move.

Except for the long excruciating reverse move into and out of CUS....

[J T]

Current they can wye the train w/o passengers if they so chose for the few times w/o a cab on the the other. They get to protect a shove twice a day EVERY day starting Monday

Whenever they needed to wye up to this point, they'd wye before the station...pull down to Pleasant St and then shove up the east leg.

I guess I'm missing the difference here as well. In the past when they arrived with one unit, they'd pull down to Pleasant and then back the train into the station. Who, if not the conductor (who was minding the passengers), was protecting the move then?

I can certainly agree with the annoyance of an every-day shove...

It's all just part of the job. God forbid someone has to do any extra work these days!

[ns8401]

Current they can wye the train w/o passengers if they so chose for the few times w/o a cab on the the other. They get to protect a shove twice a day EVERY day starting Monday

Whenever they needed to wye up to this point, they'd wye before the station...pull down to Pleasant St and then shove up the east leg.

I guess I'm missing the difference here as well. In the past when they arrived with one unit, they'd pull down to Pleasant and then back the train into the station. Who, if not the conductor (who was minding the passengers), was protecting the move then?

I can certainly agree with the annoyance of an every-day shove...

It's all just part of the job. God forbid someone has to do any extra work these days!

Aren't there usually 3 or 4 people in the cars? I've always seen an entire crew worth of people on the train plus the engineer up front and sometimes even he's not alone...

[Ypsi]

Most days on the Wolverines it's a head conductor, assistant conductor, cafe attendant, and 1 engineer. Most of the time you will see multiple people in the cab is one of the higher ups is riding along, someone is training, or someone is re qualifying or something along those lines. There are other seniaros that could play out, but generally 3 train crew members and a cafe attendant on wolverine service trains.

[ns8401]

Most days on the Wolverines it's a head conductor, assistant conductor, cafe attendant, and 1 engineer. Most of the time you will see multiple people in the cab is one of the higher ups is riding along, someone is training, or someone is re qualifying or something along those lines. There are other seniaros that could play out, but generally 3 train crew members and a cafe attendant on wolverine service trains.

So one of the conductors could be on the train and one protecting the shove...

[SD80MAC]

The times I have taken the PM, it has had a conductor, an assistant conductor, an engineer, a cafe attendant and sometimes an extra assistant conductor.

[Bulby]

I can certainly agree with the annoyance of an every-day shove...

Heaven forbid you have to shove a little ways everyday in an enclosed vestibule.

Try 4 and a half miles five times a day. You man the back-up hose, on an open platform, and you don't have the luxury of radio communication with the head end. Whistle and flag signals only, you handle all slow downs, stops, and the car full of annoying passengers. You are responsible for obeying all signal indications, and not putting the train into emergency.

On the other hand, I doubt amtrak conductors even know how to use a back-up hose make stops and slowdowns (other than dynamiting the train).

[Typhoon]

I can certainly agree with the annoyance of an every-day shove...

Heaven forbid you have to shove a little ways everyday in an enclosed vestibule.

Try 4 and a half miles five times a day. You man the back-up hose, on an open platform, and you don't have the luxury of radio communication with the head end. Whistle and flag signals only, you handle all slow downs, stops, and the car full of annoying passengers. You are responsible for obeying all signal indications, and not putting the train into emergency.

On the other hand, I doubt amtrak conductors even know how to use a back-up hose make stops and slowdowns (other than dynamiting the train).

It is sad that you find those passengers "annoying". That attitude is one of the reasons I am no longer a member of IRM, as to many of the volunteers there treat the museum as their own personal train set. Many come off with the attitude that all other members and guests, who help pay for the operation of the museum, be darn. That same attitude even starts to show in some posts made on their Yahoo group.

Now, I am not calling out everyone up there, as there are some real good people giving their time and money for preservation. They should be commended for what they do.

Let us also not forget, if an Amtrak conductor screws up protecting the back-up move, that could be his/her job. Their livelihood could be lost doing a shove that should not have been required, had any thought gone into the construction of the station. If a museum volunteer messes up, what is the worse that can happen? You don't play choo-choos any more? That is a little bit different outcome in the big scheme of things....


It is also sad that IRM no longer gives the person protecting the shove a radio, as they did in the past.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=p ... cMWdnnNvfU

You can hear the conductor protecting Olson Road at around the 16 second mark. The video was taken in 1992.

[Bulby]

That comment about annoying passengers was sarcasm, I guess you didn't catch that.

I like getting to work the passenger side every once in a while. Watching covered hoppers and tanks roll by gets boring after awhile.

The attitude of which you speak is not one that I embrace, and indeed is part of why some parts of IRM never see my name on their volunteer logs.

IRM conductors get radios, but when was the last time you tried to talk via hand-held to an engineer using a hand-held while the engineer is operating a steam locomotive. Assuming you can get air time to talk to the engineer. Flags and the locomotive whistle are much more effective.

It is just as easy to get killed at an operating railroad museum "playing choo-choo" as you put it, as on a real railroad (if not more so from lack of modern safety appliances). See what happened in North Freedom.

If you screw up bad enough on the tailhose, you will cause injuries, no question about it. I've personally seen 4 or 5 close calls, where one more bad decision could have put the train on the ground or into a semi-truck

[MQT1223]

That comment about annoying passengers was sarcasm, I guess you didn't catch that.

I like getting to work the passenger side every once in a while. Watching covered hoppers and tanks roll by gets boring after awhile.

The attitude of which you speak is not one that I embrace, and indeed is part of why some parts of IRM never see my name on their volunteer logs.

IRM conductors get radios, but when was the last time you tried to talk via hand-held to an engineer using a hand-held while the engineer is operating a steam locomotive. Assuming you can get air time to talk to the engineer. Flags and the locomotive whistle are much more effective.

It is just as easy to get killed at an operating railroad museum "playing choo-choo" as you put it, as on a real railroad (if not more so from lack of modern safety appliances). See what happened in North Freedom.

If you screw up bad enough on the tailhose, you will cause injuries, no question about it. I've personally seen 4 or 5 close calls, where one more bad decision could have put the train on the ground or into a semi-truck

Yeah how about that accident at Mid-Continent a few months back... tragic.

[Buster Manning]

On the other hand, I doubt amtrak conductors even know how to use a back-up hose make stops and slowdowns (other than dynamiting the train).

Oh, I'm sure there are some who know how to do that; however, as a result of too many accidents and incidents involving such practices, they no longer are allowed to do anything with a back-up hose other than putting a train in emergency ( and as an engineer, I didn't want anybody doing anything with the air....give me decent car counts is all I ask and I can do the rest.)

[Bulby]

If there is a back up hose in place, then the person manning the hose should at least have to do a running brake test. A qualified, trained person using the hose can put the train in on a dime without clogging up the radio.

Just leave your brake valve in release, and shut off the throttle when you come to a stop.

On the other hand, if the engineer fails to react for whatever reason, I'd rather bring it to a gentle stop than throw it into emergency with a train full of passengers. I take pride in gentle stops that don't throw the passengers out of their seats. I just can't help it when the engineer yanks out the throttle before the slack is stretched out.