GDLK News

[penn central]

In Friday's Trains Magazine News Wire it says that 9.3 million of Tiger Grant funds have been allocated for improvements between Kalamazoo and Dearborn Mich, Last weekend i spent 4 hours at BO Tower and Gearhart Yard Ex Botsford Yard taking in the scenery it was like a trip back in time.

[NSSD70ACe]

In Friday's Trains Magazine News Wire it says that 9.3 million of Tiger Grant funds have been allocated for improvements between Kalamazoo and Dearborn Mich, Last weekend i spent 4 hours at BO Tower and Gearhart Yard Ex Botsford Yard taking in the scenery it was like a trip back in time.

Got that right.

[GTW]

If I am reading this Tiger grant right it looks like the money is for double track from Kalamazoo to Battle Creek.


Tom

[NSSD70ACe]

If I am reading this Tiger grant right it looks like the money is for double track from Kalamazoo to Battle Creek.


Tom

Really?! That would explain the staging for cars to BC by GDLK.

I think its time to go foamer again...

Oh, and was that segment ever double tracked?

[Super Chief]

Confirmed today that GDLK is designated freight operator for the Kazoo to BC line. Also 501 today had 70 cars behind lone 4009. Part of the consist was tanker cars with the 1267 placard Petroleum Crude Oil. Anybody know where these are going or came from. About 10 cars of crude today. Siding at Johanson's just about done still awaiting switch.
US trackworks Wayland did the job.

[NSSD70ACe]

Confirmed today that GDLK is designated freight operator for the Kazoo to BC line. Also 501 today had 70 cars behind lone 4009. Part of the consist was tanker cars with the 1267 placard Petroleum Crude Oil. Anybody know where these are going or came from. About 10 cars of crude today. Siding at Johanson's just about done still awaiting switch.
US trackworks Wayland did the job.

This is incredible. For the first time since 2009 regular freight service will return east of Kalamazoo. Will they be receiving more locomotives to handle the new jobs?

[Super Chief]

They did start with 11 locomotives 4 years ago but are now down to 7. So I would think this would be a correct assumption. 4125 seems to be hit or miss on the road train anymore so they might need to replace the old girl? Now I'm wondering if ADM did'nt put there grannery in last year because they knew the Enbridge pipeline ran through the property and they would have had a real mess with a yard sitting over the pipeline being replaced with the new one.

[NSSD70ACe]

They did start with 11 locomotives 4 years ago but are now down to 7. So I would think this would be a correct assumption. 4125 seems to be hit or miss on the road train anymore so they might need to replace the old girl? Now I'm wondering if ADM did'nt put there grannery in last year because they knew the Enbridge pipeline ran through the property and they would have had a real mess with a yard sitting over the pipeline being replaced with the new one.

Didn't they have some from BNSF that worked their way up here on 302 one year? Did they go back?

[GTW]

NSSD70ACe,

To answer your question the Mich Line was double track west of Kalamazoo up to about 1968 and to the east around 1987. The GTW was single tracking the section between Penn and Schoolcraft about the same time...

[CSX_CO]

Still no filing with the STB by the state of Michigan making GDLK the freight operator between K-zoo and BC. Further, no filings from NS stating they're NOT going to be the freight operator. Original agreement between State and NS for the sale of the line, designates NS as the operator.

I would also bet that with a 'state' owned railroad, they'd have to have a filing saying NS is not going to be providing freight service, and then a filing stating they're seeking a freight operator for the segment. I would bet that the 'state' would be required to open it up for bids and operating proposals before just awarding something like that. Sort of like highway contracts, etc.

The Tri-County Co-Op which purchased the Wabash Sub from CSX had to open up for operating proposals. Anyone could apply. Obviously, it was awarded to a company that could provide the service and best business plan. A group of friends/co-workers were in the process of formulating a business plan to throw my hat in the ring as 'designated operator'. But, ran out of time before we could get out ducks in a row.

Its not to say GDLK couldn't be the freight operator for the line, but there hasn't been any STB filings (and this stuff would require filings) to back up the rumor they're getting it.

Practice Safe CSX

[railohio]

Its not to say GDLK couldn't be the freight operator for the line, but there hasn't been any STB filings (and this stuff would require filings) to back up the rumor they're getting it.

QFT.

[Standard Railfan]

Its not to say GDLK couldn't be the freight operator for the line, but there hasn't been any STB filings (and this stuff would require filings) to back up the rumor they're getting it.

Practice Safe CSX

Is it possible that NS is still the "Operator" and GDLK is providing locomotives and crews? I do not spend much time reading STB rules. I am curious if that is possible in today's "deregulated" environment.

[PatAzo]

It's been a rumor from Grand Elk management to their people that they will eventually take over freight service east of Kalamazoo a couple years after the MDOT sale was completed. It would be a good move for both the shippers. NS made no bones about wanting out of west and central Michigan. Watco was interested in the whole works a few years ago.

It's makes sense all around. But there is nothing showing up with the STB. Grand Elk filing to take over or the UTU's objections. Someday probably but not imminent.

It would be nice to see freight traffic come back west through Kalamazoo.

[CSX_CO]

Is it possible that NS is still the "Operator" and GDLK is providing locomotives and crews? I do not spend much time reading STB rules. I am curious if that is possible in today's "deregulated" environment.

If GDLK is providing the locomotives and crews, then NS isn't the operator then. STB would have a problem with it, and the labor Unions on NS probably would have a problem with that. Plus, GDLK has no operating rights on the Michigan Line east of K-zoo anyway. Until they get operating rights (which would require a filing) then they can't run out there with their crews, their locomotives, etc without some agreement with NS, which gets filed with the STB.

I'm more inclinded to believe that NS is working out an interchange deal with GDLK to get the Knappen Milling cars at K-zoo, rather than taking them to Toledo-Jackson and back to BC. Be fairly easy to operate a job out of BC to K-zoo, working Knappen both ways if needed. Added bonus would be no need to double handle any other traffic if it is already running through Elkhart once.

A similar 'setup' exists between CSX and LIRC in southern Indiana. LIRC moves the Seymour local's cars for the B&O across southern IN to Seymour for CSX. They pickup/setout any cars there. CSX then is free to base a job down there, and the LIRC feeds the cars to them. LIRC picks up a little revenue moving the cars, and CSX avoids the expense of having to run their own job to feed the cars to the line.

Practice Safe CSX

[JStryker722]

Is it possible that NS is still the "Operator" and GDLK is providing locomotives and crews? I do not spend much time reading STB rules. I am curious if that is possible in today's "deregulated" environment.

If GDLK is providing the locomotives and crews, then NS isn't the operator then. STB would have a problem with it, and the labor Unions on NS probably would have a problem with that. Plus, GDLK has no operating rights on the Michigan Line east of K-zoo anyway. Until they get operating rights (which would require a filing) then they can't run out there with their crews, their locomotives, etc without some agreement with NS, which gets filed with the STB.

I'm more inclinded to believe that NS is working out an interchange deal with GDLK to get the Knappen Milling cars at K-zoo, rather than taking them to Toledo-Jackson and back to BC. Be fairly easy to operate a job out of BC to K-zoo, working Knappen both ways if needed. Added bonus would be no need to double handle any other traffic if it is already running through Elkhart once.

Practice Safe CSX

Not to say you are wrong,but I remember the MDOT-NS JOA stating that NS holds the exclusive freight rights but could lease out those rights to nearby freight operators. Having that been said,GDLK is likely to take over the KAL-BC segment,just a matter of the paper work with the STB being finalized.

[CSX_CO]

Not to say you are wrong,but I remember the MDOT-NS JOA stating that NS holds the exclusive freight rights but could lease out those rights to nearby freight operators. Having that been said,GDLK is likely to take over the KAL-BC segment,just a matter of the paper work with the STB being finalized.

Ok. You have to make an initial filing to start the process. It isn't 'just a matter of paperwork'. Shippers have the chance to voice their concerns, on-line communities get to voice their concerns, labor unions, etc etc etc. It isn't just as simple as NS going "XXXX is now running the trains, here's the forms." STB is going to want proof that service will not be affected by the change in operators. I'm sure they're going to require a caveat that if service 'slips' then they have the right to terminate the lease if the shippers cry, and NS would have to take over operations again.

Stuff like this takes months, not 3 weeks since the initial filing for the State assuming control, appointing operators, etc.

In so far as 'wanting out of Michigan' NS was simply forcing the state (and AMTRAK's) hand. NS got exactly what they wanted. Let the tracks get 'bad enough' that the State of Michigan had to step in to maintain service levels. Did the whole "Gee, gosh, golly, we really don't make enough on the operations up there to warrant keeping that 79mph track..." Logical step was for the state to assume control of the railroad. NS gets a chunk of change for the sale, retains the 'gravy' of the freight operations, for what really seems like pennies per car. Be silly at this point to 'pull out' without seeing what kind of revenue they can get now. Especially since NS is on the lamb for the improvements to keep freight service on the line. I would have thought if they weren't interested, that would have been laid out in the initial filing, that a new operator would be sought to provide service on the long term, and on the short term NS keeps moving cars. After all, buffs seem to think that NS is the one with the greatest customer service in the world, and they wouldn't want to bamboozle shippers. That's something CSX does...

Practice Safe CSX

[JStryker722]

Not to say you are wrong,but I remember the MDOT-NS JOA stating that NS holds the exclusive freight rights but could lease out those rights to nearby freight operators. Having that been said,GDLK is likely to take over the KAL-BC segment,just a matter of the paper work with the STB being finalized.

Ok. You have to make an initial filing to start the process. It isn't 'just a matter of paperwork'. Shippers have the chance to voice their concerns, on-line communities get to voice their concerns, labor unions, etc etc etc. It isn't just as simple as NS going "XXXX is now running the trains, here's the forms." STB is going to want proof that service will not be affected by the change in operators. I'm sure they're going to require a caveat that if service 'slips' then they have the right to terminate the lease if the shippers cry, and NS would have to take over operations again.

Stuff like this takes months, not 3 weeks since the initial filing for the State assuming control, appointing operators, etc.

In so far as 'wanting out of Michigan' NS was simply forcing the state (and AMTRAK's) hand. NS got exactly what they wanted. Let the tracks get 'bad enough' that the State of Michigan had to step in to maintain service levels. Did the whole "Gee, gosh, golly, we really don't make enough on the operations up there to warrant keeping that 79mph track..." Logical step was for the state to assume control of the railroad. NS gets a chunk of change for the sale, retains the 'gravy' of the freight operations, for what really seems like pennies per car. Be silly at this point to 'pull out' without seeing what kind of revenue they can get now. Especially since NS is on the lamb for the improvements to keep freight service on the line. I would have thought if they weren't interested, that would have been laid out in the initial filing, that a new operator would be sought to provide service on the long term, and on the short term NS keeps moving cars. After all, buffs seem to think that NS is the one with the greatest customer service in the world, and they wouldn't want to bamboozle shippers. That's something CSX does...

Practice Safe CSX

Oops I posted my last post in response to not what you last said but the time before that. You posted this last time while I was responding and never saw it. Ignore my response CSX_Co.

[NSSD70ACe]

In any case, wouldn't it be some time before it shows in the system, say, a couple days?

Or maybe they haven't filled it out yet?

[Brakey]