LSRC now off limits

[Norm]

shorthaul is right, nobody deserves the harrasment because of this.

I can't totally agree with that. One person can surely screw things over for all of us who try to abide by the rules and get hassled because that person has done wrong. The other side of the coin as I see it is to ostracize him from the railfan forums; not just this one, but all of them. That should get the message across that there are those of us who follow the rules. Trespassers become a liability to the railroad any time they are on the property. Don't believe that? Just look at the number of lawsuits resulting from some youngster walking the gauge and having his Ipod so loud he can't hear the horn.

I'm of the old school that says people should take responsibility for their own actions.

Off my soapbox.

[Crow T Robot]

I did not expect any member of this board to condone the behavior of those involved.
Anyone with any respect for the concept of responsible behavior must condemn those actions.

The sad part is that there are parents that actually raise their children with such lax values
and disrespect for the the law or the rights of others.

Good point and one that I completely agree with. I posted this on another thread but if you watch it whats the one thing missing on all the boxcars going by on the trains. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WPzptAVus5Y

[canpac08]

From reading all the posts so far on this subject. I can honestly say I have mixed feeling's about the whole thing, and that is because I know that when the story is good everyone wants to interject, their two cents about ostracizing certain people. That might be a good last resort but until we know all the facts about this. Maybe the LSRC like stated earlier, was acting due the nature of liability insurance. Maybe it was due to unsafe acts of a few people, or trespassing (on property with out a pass). I myself with wait til the whole truth comes out to pass judgment, because that is what I and most people on this board would want done for them. If ostracizing is the best answer in the end so be inf not. If not either way we all learned a valuable lesson, and should remember, just because we are decent rail-fans dose not mean we have a right to be in a rail yard or on railroad property and the carriers can ban use at anytime. Also if this is a newbie rail-fan, It behooves us, as rail-fans to help steer them down the right path instead of shut them out we all were new at this hobby at one point and, all could use help and pointers at one point. Why not extend a hand of help, if this was an honest mistake.I know if that was me I would want help to learn about a great hobby that involves trains.

Judge Not Lest Ye Be Judged

[Josh]

What has been described sounds like a person that use to be on this board known for screwing things up. Im glade i decided to stop up in Saginaw last month to shoot the alcos all sitting at the shop, i feel lucky now that they gave me a pass on the property.

Well it looks like i decided to stop by saginaw to late. LSRC found pictures a few days before i came there taken by railfans on various rail photography websites of their yard and locomotives by railfans (who i assume got premission) and is now off limmits to cameras. I cant blame them though, you could think of it as someone you dont know coming into your house taking pictures and posting them on the internet. I was bummed out my camera had to stay in the car since LSRC's new units had just arived and all of they'r alcos were parked next to the round house Would have made for great pictures. It was very nice of them to let some one they dont know wander on to their property. All the employes were very nice and talked to me for a while.

[ETR#101]

shorthaul is right, nobody deserves the harrasment because of this.

I can't totally agree with that. One person can surely screw things over for all of us who try to abide by the rules and get hassled because that person has done wrong. The other side of the coin as I see it is to ostracize him from the railfan forums; not just this one, but all of them. That should get the message across that there are those of us who follow the rules. Trespassers become a liability to the railroad any time they are on the property. Don't believe that? Just look at the number of lawsuits resulting from some youngster walking the gauge and having his Ipod so loud he can't hear the horn.

I'm of the old school that says people should take responsibility for their own actions.

Off my soapbox.

I can agree with that actually.Banning the guy or gal from rail fourms such as this would be a good move in getting a message across. I'm just concerned it could go beyond the relm of internet anonymity. If people continually find this person ruining fanning experiences for everyone else and confronts them in "real" life, words are said, it gets personal....someone goes to their car mumbling...comes back with some steel....
again, as silly as that sounds...it happens alot. Not really with railfanning....just in general.

I'm with you in the old school way of thinking. People should absolutly take responsability for their actions. Unfortunatly, keeping him/her from forums isn't going to stop him/her from fanning and continuing to ruin something most hold dear. Maybe they just don't care. Then how do you deal with it? That's where the "real" life confontation ends up happening.

[MIGN-Todd]

As a railfan, I believe the best part of the whole experience of hearing the train approach, then passing, and finally disapeering into the woods is the surprize of the consist. I could care less about the paperwork or other discarded crap the railroad gets rid of. I have no business in the railroads yard either. It's a place of business not a carnival attraction. The closest I get is when I pass through Cadillac on the road. I'll take a look at what's parking there and go on my way. Same with the line along 131 or up in TC. One might want to officially ask LSRC if they can set aside a day like a Sunday, for Railfans to come get a supervised look at the remaining Alcos and other motive power. I'm sure they know how special those old girls are to a number of people throughout Michigan. With access like that granted, it may just keep people from wanting to tresspass just for a few pictures.... - just a thought.

[DTI973]

It's unfortunately a psychology/sociology component. We all know someone that always pushes the envelope/boundary. They don't know of self-restraint or common sense. And ultimately ruin it for everyone.

In today's "extreme' society where it seems to be ok and even 'cool' to do stupid things we keep devolving.

It's the same thing that has us with some ridiculous laws to protect ourselves from ourselves....it's not to protect the responsible....more often the irresponsible.

Just my .02 worth

[TSB]

1. If anyone knows who caused the problem they should post his/her name. That
assumes that there actually is a guilty party.

2. It is explained to that fool how highly qualified he/she is for a trip down the porcelian
receptacle. All on the board join in,

3. Someone with more compassion than me (that is almost all of you) explain the process
of redemption to that person.

4. Move on. It is OK to remember, but let it be.

Just sayin'

[Shorthaul]

I did not expect any member of this board to condone the behavior of those involved.
Anyone with any respect for the concept of responsible behavior must condemn those actions.

The sad part is that there are parents that actually raise their children with such lax values
and disrespect for the the law or the rights of others.

If you are referring my post, and I believe you are, I did not intend in ANY WAY to make it seem like I was in suppport of this behavior. I was only making the point that maybe this individual was inexperienced, instead of jumping to conclusions that he was irresponsible. I am only trying to point out that there are other explinations, instead of assuming the worst. There is nothing lax about that. If anything, teaching your children to see both sides of issue is the most responsible thing to do, at least in my mind.

[midland sub]

How ironic that a forum filled with railfans hiding behind screen names have a topic demanding we "out" someone for an alleged incident. Remember there is always two sides to these tales and usually the truth is somewhere in the middle. With the rage that a topic like this creates, usually the farther from the truth we get with each time it's discussed.

[TSB]

...maybe this individual was inexperienced, instead of jumping to conclusions that he was irresponsible. I am only trying to point out that there are other explinations, instead of assuming the worst. There is nothing lax about that. If anything, teaching your children to see both sides of issue is the most responsible thing to do, at least in my mind.

Both sides of an issue is not likely to be a question here. That would only be the case if LSRC and the individual had a disagreement involving some sort of neutral ground and LSRC issued a warning or had some other mild response.

The person involved encroached on the property of LSRC and committed acts sufficiently offensive for a company with a well earned reputation of cooperation with railfans to take such an uncustomarily severe position. LSRC would not react to an "inexperienced" or otherwise innocent act in such a draconian way.

I could be wrong, but...

[PAT.C]

THE HORSE IS DEAD NOW. WE CAN STOP BEATING IT AND HAVE A CELEBRATION DRINK.

I LIKE BEER !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[ETR#101]

Ohhhh....I like beer too.

[redside20]

you guys want to know what i would do to this idiot....absolutely nothing..in the end, karma will be the one kicking his ass, always will

[bdconrail29]

Ok, we're sad. LSRC is now off limits. Oh well. Who cares. I'll wake up tomorrow. Get on with life.

[canpac08]

Ok, we're sad. LSRC is now off limits. Oh well. Who cares. I'll wake up tomorrow. Get on with life.

me too, there are other places to rail-fan the LSRC was not and will never be the be all end all

[sd70accsxt700]

LSRC found pictures a few days before i came there taken by railfans on various rail photography websites of their yard and locomotives by railfans (who i assume got premission) and is now off limmits to cameras.

Say what? Does that even make sense? You can still come on the property but you cant take photos? Ok I under stand this for a manafacturing company, not letting company secrets out, but a railroad? What secreats do they have to hide except stuff they should not be doing to begin with (no this is not ment as a statement that they are doing something wrong, just say that is the only reason I can think of for not allowing photos). I mean anyone with a zoom lense, can get all the photos they want of the LSRC roundhouse (from the outside) and locomotives from the Wadsworth St walkway bridge. No reasons to even have to go in the yard. Pluss if they are worried about items "coming up missing" because of photos, eventualy the "in service" locos have to leave the yard to be usefull to a railroad. As far as out of service locos, see what I said about the walkway.

I dont understand this?

And as far as who, what when and where, I believe it is one or two indivaduals that are always that the heart of this. This has been a on going problem before I worked there (for CSX, and no not as far as steeling stuff, but said people being told to leave they dont belong there, but the next day they were right back at it again), but has gotten worse after LSRC and beloved Alcos came to town.

[j32885]

The last thing I heard anything about Lake State was that the State Of Michigan had a lawsuit against them and they were getting rid of the older diesel locomotives.

[A No.1]

I dont even know where the LSRC is!? LoL.

[LSRC]

I dont even know where the LSRC is!? LoL.

I'm right here, man.