CSX Alpha Symbols...Real or Rumor?

[Schteinkuh]

The Eastern Railroad News forums stated the following a little while ago:

"CSX Institutes Variable Scheduling, Bringing Back Alpha Symbols
JACKSONVILLE, FL – March 26, 2015 - CSX Transportation will be introducing its new ‘variable scheduling’ operations beginning at 12:01am on March 27, which shifts train operations for many trains and is the first step in restoration of BNSF –like alpha symbols.
CSXT will no longer be using set 24-hour schedules, as the variable scheduling introduces the new 28-hour incremental operating plan. The plan involves what CSXT hopes will be longer trains, one train dropped weekly, and a potential cost savings of the reduction of locomotives needed, manpower required for operations, and other measures.
The variable scheduling is theorized to work as follows: A train departs a terminal on a Sunday at 0800, the next departs 28-hours later Monday at noon, and Tuesday at 1600, etc.
A CSXT source indicates that the initial group of trains affected by this new variable scheduling will include everything but symbols residing in the 100, 200, and 700 series.
The move is expected to allow traffic to build and allow more efficient operation.
In conjunction with the new scheduling, CSXT is readying its new alpha code symbol system that will mimic BNSF’s symbol system – a train type identifier; a three digit origination and destination code; a number priority assignment; and the date.
There is no firm date on the total alpha symbol switch-over. However, it is expected to take place over the next few months while some trains will be phased out of the old numeric system and in to the alpha codes."

Now, with April fools right around the corner, this could be one massive troll. I have seen no official statement from CSX about this topic. Has anyone else heard about this, and can confirm that it is true?

[Saturnalia]

mmmmkay. Worded like a news article, not from a news source.

Quick Google Search of some of the text returns no results.

I'm gonna go with not real. 90% confidence.

[CSX_CO]

Long term goal has been alpha numeric train symbols with the upgrading of the dispatcher software. Hadn't heard it was being implemented.

The variable schedule is 100% true. Not all trains though, most terminals are trying it with just a couple to half dozen.

[Saturnalia]

*to clarify right now, my confidence rating is on the "article" itself. I have no knowledge of the inner-workings of CSX

[CSX_CO]

*to clarify right now, my confidence rating is on the "article" itself. I have no knowledge of the inner-workings of CSX

Article came off eastern rail news. 100% confidence in that...

[Saturnalia]

http://cs.trains.com/trn/b/fred-frailey ... thing.aspx

Explains the new system in detail.

[Ypsi]

Hmmmmmmm... Ummmm.. I'm not sure I get the purpose of changing departure times on non-intermodal and automobile traffic.. I also can't really see where the savings are and why the letter change matters. Defiantly not like BNSF or whatever but it's still just about as confusing to me .

A couple questions that I have are:
-Does this mean most CSX routes will have scrambled train times now?
-How does the later departure affect loading and idel time. I would assume at most facilities the cars are loaded around the same time, so would a train sit for almost 10-12 house loaded befor getting a crew and departing? (Although this could be the case of a terminal is a mess as is I guess *not siting any particular spots as I have little idea just making a statement)
-Does this also mean that the "7th" day of the cycles (sunday?) will see less trains across the system as a whole? I know that may already kind of be the case but it sounds like this could really make a difference if I'm understanding what they are saying.

Those are my main "outsider" questions as I try to understand what this will do. Thanks guys

[Saturnalia]

Since the 7th day is cycled out by the week as a whole, there should be no wholesale slow days. I am suspecting what train "starts" on what day may not all be the same day of the week for every train.

The different letter for each train will help differentiate for planner and such I believe...describes to them what the schedule should be.

Probably time to start understanding the Q-series as a wholesale number series, dropping the letter, and understanding the letter is applied based on this cycle.

[CSX_CO]

Hmmmmmmm... Ummmm.. I'm not sure I get the purpose of changing departure times on non-intermodal and automobile traffic.. I also can't really see where the savings are and why the letter change matters.

Savings will be in reduced locomotive needs (since CSX is power short) and reduced planned crew starts. Be 1 saved crew, per train, per week. Of course crew savings hinge on the ability of the dispatchers to get the trains over the road. Also, by running bigger trains, with the tonnage better matched to power sets, you're getting better power utilization. A train that averages 50 to 60 cars per day would need two locomotives, with perhaps a lot of extra horsepower that isn't being fully utilized on the train. Running 28 hr head ways means you're getting more cars (in theory) on those trains, and better maxing out the power assigned to them.

A couple questions that I have are:
-Does this mean most CSX routes will have scrambled train times now?

Everything is still scheduled, you just won't be able to 'set your watch' to know when a train will be at a specific point, unless you know the train schedules and how they rotate.

Also note that not every train is going to this schedule. Just the ones that typically aren't usually 'heavy' traffic trains.

-How does the later departure affect loading and idel time. I would assume at most facilities the cars are loaded around the same time, so would a train sit for almost 10-12 house loaded befor getting a crew and departing? (Although this could be the case of a terminal is a mess as is I guess *not siting any particular spots as I have little idea just making a statement)

Car dwells will probably go 'up' compared to a 24 hr schedule, but with how messed up the merchandise network is right now, it *may* make an improvement over the long run if this plan is pulled off. We've had cars sit for a day or two after being 'ready' for departure, waiting on power. By the time they arrive, process, and depart they've been in the yard 50+ hrs. Ideally, when things are running as they should, a car should only sit 32 hrs at most, and 10 hrs (or less if things are REALLY humming) at the least. When a car arrives at a terminal, it has a 'cut off' time to be on the next train. Arrival to departure is 10 hrs. Meaning, a yard should be able to process a car in 10 hrs, and get in on its next scheduled train. So, if Q345 is scheduled to depart at 1000, any car that arrived before 0001 schedules to that train, and is expected to be on that train. With traffic 'backed up' waiting on power like it has, the 'right car right train' numbers are horrible.

By lessening the power demands on the terminals, you could in time see more fluid operations and traffic moving better than trying to run a train profile from 2 days prior because of how the cars were scheduled to depart. Terminals can't get 'ahead' when you're required to run a 2 day old train profile because of car scheduling commitments.

-Does this also mean that the "7th" day of the cycles (sunday?) will see less trains across the system as a whole? I know that may already kind of be the case but it sounds like this could really make a difference if I'm understanding what they are saying.

Again, not every train is doing this schedule. Even with terminals that have multiple trains on this rotating schedule, there is still spacing between them so you really won't see a 'dead' day. Everything is just going to be on a rotating 28 hr schedule, vs 24 hrs now. This will also spread out the trains, so hopefully traffic doesn't 'pile up' on the trains only scheduled for 5 day a week operation. It never fails that the day before a scheduled annulment, 50 extra cars show up for that train.

One possible problem I see, is if a train does see a 'spike' in traffic on a given day, will 'extra' profiles be given? Sometimes, especially at terminals at interchange points, a foreign line may not deliver a train for 24 hrs plus because of a problem on their network. So, if you only have 60 cars for that scheduled departure, then 150 show up just after it leaves, will the terminals be required to 'sit' on that traffic for 28 hrs? That's part of the problem right now, Network Ops isn't 'granting' extra sections of trains, so terminals are per verbally behind trying to work off traffic. Its impossible to reduce car counts when you have length restrictions on trains, more cars than you can run, and you can't run an extra profile to move those cars off line. The whole "run them as big as you can" only works when there is no limits on how big you can run them. If you have 12,000' of cars for a train with an 8000' restriction, you're never going to 'get ahead' of that traffic.

The different letter for each train will help differentiate for planner and such I believe...describes to them what the schedule should be...Probably time to start understanding the Q-series as a wholesale number series, dropping the letter, and understanding the letter is applied based on this cycle.

The whole symbol thing is the weak point on this. It is confusing as hell as to what train you're supposed to be calling it. We have a chart made up for when this starts. We've been doing this with the 310 traffic from Indy to Columbus and Russell, KY for a month now. It 'works' mostly because we have a ton of traffic, so it is easy to 'fill a track' for that train, and get it ready to depart. I suspect that might be why there is a push to go to the alpha-numeric train symbols. No Q,X,S,L,R, etc symbols. You just type in the station monkiers and then the date and away you go. Hopefully they just go to engine number ID's as that would really clear up the chatter on the road channels.

Practice Safe CSX
I have my Little Orphan Annie magic decoder ring at the ready...

[Ypsi]

Thanks CSX_CO that clears some stuff up. sounds like there will most certainly be a learning curve for this system

[SousaKerry]

[SD80MAC]

I really hope we can just use the engine number as an identifier on the radio, like basically every other (aside from NS) railroad.

[CSX Q109]

Hi Everyone I understand that All CSX the trains have Alpha symbols Like Q309 Is a.k.a M-WALIND,Q410 M-WAXSEL, Q415 shows as M-CBLRMT and Q676 as the M-NASHAM. So My question is what would CSX Q090 and 091 be called under the Alpha symbols? Thanks.

[¶aragraph]

What they show:
Q090 ZWASKP/ZDLSK3/ZDLSK5
Q091 ZSKWAP/ZSKDL5/ZSKDL3

[Doktor No]

Again, I find this more then amusing. To simplify...before, when a train ended up being LATE on departure then the originating terminal took a HIT on that departure. All bound up in the daily reports and reasons were given but that was a joke too....now NOTHING will be late, everything will be peachy for the railroad (the customers whose cars sit longer in the yard and the yard full of sitting cars won't be thinking PEACHY at all.) Then again, experst agree, everything is fine.
While it supposedly WAS a scheduled railroad, that fell apart. While there USED to be a ONE PLAN, that went by the wayside after awhile. They come up with neat binders with great PLANS all in paper and then its slap yourself on the back time...
Again, lets make another plan, keep our jobs and CARRY ON.
EHH is laughing.

[CSX_CO]

Again, I find this more then amusing. To simplify...before, when a train ended up being LATE on departure then the originating terminal took a HIT on that departure. All bound up in the daily reports and reasons were given but that was a joke too....now NOTHING will be late, everything will be peachy for the railroad (the customers whose cars sit longer in the yard and the yard full of sitting cars won't be thinking PEACHY at all.) Then again, experst agree, everything is fine.
While it supposedly WAS a scheduled railroad, that fell apart. While there USED to be a ONE PLAN, that went by the wayside after awhile. They come up with neat binders with great PLANS all in paper and then its slap yourself on the back time...
Again, lets make another plan, keep our jobs and CARRY ON.
EHH is laughing.

There are still planned departure times, so it isn't an unscheduled railroad.

The extra 4 hrs isn't going to make or break dwell. Moot point anyway. Trains were waiting 24 hrs or more past their scheduled departure times, so just because it's a 28 hrs spacing, provided power catches up, it could reduce dwell for some cars, but it will lengthen it on others.

Frankly, come up with 500 locomotives, as has been stated by upper management, and things will work themselves out. Pull the "just in case" engine off the intermodal power sets and that would free up a lot of locomotives. Or, instead of another big 6 axle, splice a SD40 in there as the "just in case" to free up the high HP power for other duties.

Thus far, the 28 hrs spacing is resulting in the trains filling out a bit more. Trains that were always heavy still on 24 hr schedules. Now if the power would catch up with the cycles things should smooth out.

[CSX Q109]

What they show:
Q090 ZWASKP/ZDLSK3/ZDLSK5
Q091 ZSKWAP/ZSKDL5/ZSKDL3

Thanks but I was talking about when they are on CSX them are UP symbols.

[Saturnalia]

What they show:
Q090 ZWASKP/ZDLSK3/ZDLSK5
Q091 ZSKWAP/ZSKDL5/ZSKDL3

Thanks but I was talking about when they are on CSX them are UP symbols.

CSX doesn't have Alpha-numeric symbols yet...they still run with their old number and for manifests and such, a cycle of prefixes.

[CSX_CO]

What they show:
Q090 ZWASKP/ZDLSK3/ZDLSK5
Q091 ZSKWAP/ZSKDL5/ZSKDL3

Thanks but I was talking about when they are on CSX them are UP symbols.

CSX doesn't have Alpha-numeric symbols yet...they still run with their old number and for manifests and such, a cycle of prefixes.

Some screens have the alpha numeric symbols on them. Q090 just doesn't have one. A couple intermodals I checked don't either.